Comments on: Kill the school boards http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/ If the foundations be destroyed, what shall the righteous do? --Psalm 11:3 Wed, 28 Jul 2010 00:54:22 -0600 http://wordpress.org/?v=abc hourly 1 By: Instructify » Blog Archive » Carnival of Education #158 http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/comment-page-1/#comment-88135 Instructify » Blog Archive » Carnival of Education #158 Wed, 13 Feb 2008 21:10:14 +0000 http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/#comment-88135 [...] Get Some Alone Time: Dana at Principled Discovery doesn’t like the idea of the federal government butting in and bossing around local schools. [...] [...] Get Some Alone Time: Dana at Principled Discovery doesn’t like the idea of the federal government butting in and bossing around local schools. [...]

]]> By: Shawna http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/comment-page-1/#comment-48588 Shawna Thu, 07 Feb 2008 04:22:57 +0000 http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/#comment-48588 Interesting because most liberals I know would not consider Bush liberal. It seems nobody is willing to claim him :-) Back to the post/point, to me a "right" to an education does not imply a mandate/obligation, simply a guarantee that you will not be left without. And yes, I agree that most parents tend to know what is best for their child... I just don't think a national curriculum necessarily gets in the way of that. As long as there are still choices about where and ways in which parents wish to educate their children. Anyways, hope that clarified my jumbled, sometimes contradictory thinking :-) And thanks for the clinton education link. Interesting because most liberals I know would not consider Bush liberal. It seems nobody is willing to claim him :-)

Back to the post/point, to me a “right” to an education does not imply a mandate/obligation, simply a guarantee that you will not be left without.

And yes, I agree that most parents tend to know what is best for their child… I just don’t think a national curriculum necessarily gets in the way of that. As long as there are still choices about where and ways in which parents wish to educate their children.

Anyways, hope that clarified my jumbled, sometimes contradictory thinking :-)

And thanks for the clinton education link.

]]> By: Dana http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/comment-page-1/#comment-48093 Dana Thu, 07 Feb 2008 01:57:51 +0000 http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/#comment-48093 You know, he really is pretty liberal. He let Ted Kennedy write his signature education package, has definitely increased the size of government and isn't what I'd call a fiscal conservative. "Compassionate" conservative only meant he planned to spend money on everything rather than just what conservatives spend money on. : ) You know, he really is pretty liberal. He let Ted Kennedy write his signature education package, has definitely increased the size of government and isn’t what I’d call a fiscal conservative. “Compassionate” conservative only meant he planned to spend money on everything rather than just what conservatives spend money on. : )

]]> By: Shawna http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/comment-page-1/#comment-48065 Shawna Thu, 07 Feb 2008 01:51:55 +0000 http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/#comment-48065 If Bush is considered a Democrat I think I must just have to leave the party :-) If Bush is considered a Democrat I think I must just have to leave the party :-)

]]> By: Dana http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/comment-page-1/#comment-46501 Dana Wed, 06 Feb 2008 20:19:51 +0000 http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/#comment-46501 I'm not sure exactly what Peter is referring to and can't speak for him, but a lot of people on the more conservative side of the Republican Party view Bush as being practically a Democrat. : ) But what he did with NCLB was only a continuation of what Clinton started with his education plan. http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/stories/1999/05/19/clinton.education/ And Senator Clinton really just seems to want more funding for the same program, nothing radically different. I agree that we have a "right" to an education, but we need to be careful about what we are saying with that. I need to look up the things I was thinking of so I don't misquote anything. I think local control is important, both out of respect for our federal system that our founding fathers wisely set up and because parents are generally more qualified than the state to determine what is best for their children. Are there parents who are not? Of course. That is why we have some safeguards in place and why we continue to support a diversified education system which includes public schools, private schools and charters. But should we force a certain type of education on all children because we fear what may be happening in a few families? No. We should focus on where we know problems exist within the public system which is not always doing well with the job that has been entrusted to it. I’m not sure exactly what Peter is referring to and can’t speak for him, but a lot of people on the more conservative side of the Republican Party view Bush as being practically a Democrat. : ) But what he did with NCLB was only a continuation of what Clinton started with his education plan.

http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/stories/1999/05/19/clinton.education/

And Senator Clinton really just seems to want more funding for the same program, nothing radically different.

I agree that we have a “right” to an education, but we need to be careful about what we are saying with that. I need to look up the things I was thinking of so I don’t misquote anything.

I think local control is important, both out of respect for our federal system that our founding fathers wisely set up and because parents are generally more qualified than the state to determine what is best for their children.

Are there parents who are not? Of course. That is why we have some safeguards in place and why we continue to support a diversified education system which includes public schools, private schools and charters. But should we force a certain type of education on all children because we fear what may be happening in a few families? No. We should focus on where we know problems exist within the public system which is not always doing well with the job that has been entrusted to it.

]]> By: Shawna http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/comment-page-1/#comment-46255 Shawna Wed, 06 Feb 2008 19:22:51 +0000 http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/#comment-46255 I wouldn't posted it if I hadn't seriously understood what I was saying. I do believe that national standards can be obtained/managed with local oversight. I do not believe that it's all or nothing. I believe in a balance of power... elected power, by the people... who have a voice, a choice. I do not see government as all bad. I do see it needing control and balance and in desperate need of accountability... but that is where the people need to come in play. I do believe in a basic standard of intelligence/knowledge. I do not trust that all parents are capable of delivering that via homeschooling, private schooling, charter schooling, etc. We all have differing resources available to us. I do think a national curriculum is a good skeleton to work with that local authorities can embellish, refine, augment... it is a foundation. And I do think we have a right to be educated... so if not all parents are capable of doing that then yes, I think that people have a "right" to a public education. So yes, I have pondered my stance carefully. And the beauty of America is that we can have different beliefs, voice them, and continue forward. As for NCLB... it was a Republican that brought that to light. So why hold Obama/Clinton/Democrats responsible for that one? You lost me there. I wouldn’t posted it if I hadn’t seriously understood what I was saying.

I do believe that national standards can be obtained/managed with local oversight.

I do not believe that it’s all or nothing. I believe in a balance of power… elected power, by the people… who have a voice, a choice.

I do not see government as all bad. I do see it needing control and balance and in desperate need of accountability… but that is where the people need to come in play.

I do believe in a basic standard of intelligence/knowledge. I do not trust that all parents are capable of delivering that via homeschooling, private schooling, charter schooling, etc. We all have differing resources available to us. I do think a national curriculum is a good skeleton to work with that local authorities can embellish, refine, augment… it is a foundation. And I do think we have a right to be educated… so if not all parents are capable of doing that then yes, I think that people have a “right” to a public education.

So yes, I have pondered my stance carefully. And the beauty of America is that we can have different beliefs, voice them, and continue forward.

As for NCLB… it was a Republican that brought that to light. So why hold Obama/Clinton/Democrats responsible for that one? You lost me there.

]]> By: Peter B http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/comment-page-1/#comment-45322 Peter B Wed, 06 Feb 2008 15:13:11 +0000 http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/#comment-45322 NCLB, that's what happens when you elect a Democrat President to run the country. Obama/Clinton aside, if McCain wins and is elected, that would make 22 years of a Democrat President. NCLB is the tip of the iceberg. That's what happens to a nation that strays from God. What makes anyone believe that America would be any different? NCLB, that’s what happens when you elect a Democrat President to run the country. Obama/Clinton aside, if McCain wins and is elected, that would make 22 years of a Democrat President.

NCLB is the tip of the iceberg. That’s what happens to a nation that strays from God. What makes anyone believe that America would be any different?

]]> By: Dana http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/comment-page-1/#comment-42681 Dana Wed, 06 Feb 2008 03:52:53 +0000 http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/#comment-42681 Shawna, I think I see what you are saying. But to me, we have all those things. We have national standards. We almost have a national curriculum based on the text book adoption process. And children are not rejected from public schools. It is difficult to expel children, and then alternative education must be provided. Recently, this is becoming an issue because of the pressure of NCLB. School districts are "pushing out" problem students and in some cases telling parents they need to homeschool them. That is just plain wrong, but an obvious problem with the insanity NCLB is creating. The problem I have with a "right to a public education" is what this will end up doing to education. First, it will define the public education as the standard, requiring us to be measured by it and accountable to it. Second, it would be a funding nightmare. If someone graduates unable to read, will they be able to sue the state or the district for damages? Even if they haven't attempted to do anything for their entire education? I'll have to look at it more, but several months ago I looked at a lot of arguments regarding education as a right and the problems that idea can bring about. Shawna, I think I see what you are saying. But to me, we have all those things. We have national standards. We almost have a national curriculum based on the text book adoption process. And children are not rejected from public schools. It is difficult to expel children, and then alternative education must be provided.

Recently, this is becoming an issue because of the pressure of NCLB. School districts are “pushing out” problem students and in some cases telling parents they need to homeschool them. That is just plain wrong, but an obvious problem with the insanity NCLB is creating.

The problem I have with a “right to a public education” is what this will end up doing to education. First, it will define the public education as the standard, requiring us to be measured by it and accountable to it. Second, it would be a funding nightmare. If someone graduates unable to read, will they be able to sue the state or the district for damages? Even if they haven’t attempted to do anything for their entire education?

I’ll have to look at it more, but several months ago I looked at a lot of arguments regarding education as a right and the problems that idea can bring about.

]]> By: Bob M. http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/comment-page-1/#comment-40863 Bob M. Tue, 05 Feb 2008 21:04:54 +0000 http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/#comment-40863 "Although I do like the idea of a national curriculum and national standards I do think that both can be managed on local levels with parental oversight/direction and local boards." Please ponder upon what you've said. Really think about it. Take a deep, deep look. Consider the two parts of your statement. Please! Please! Please! “Although I do like the idea of a national curriculum and national standards I do think that both can be managed on local levels with parental oversight/direction and local boards.”

Please ponder upon what you’ve said. Really think about it. Take a deep, deep look. Consider the two parts of your statement. Please! Please! Please!

]]> By: Shawna http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/comment-page-1/#comment-40003 Shawna Tue, 05 Feb 2008 17:43:41 +0000 http://principleddiscovery.com/2008/02/05/kill-the-school-boards/#comment-40003 Although I do like the idea of a national curriculum and national standards I do think that both can be managed on local levels with parental oversight/direction and local boards. I do not think that more government or funding is the answer nor solution. I do not like any aspect of NCLB, I do not care for universal preschool, but I do like the idea that all children have a "right" to public education. Having a right does not mean there aren't other choices available if one chooses, imo; it simply means that if other choices aren't available to you for whatever reason (usually socioeconomic) that there is some form of education and you will not be left out--as in the haves and the have nots. Now liking the idea does not mean I like an amendment! Although I do like the idea of a national curriculum and national standards I do think that both can be managed on local levels with parental oversight/direction and local boards. I do not think that more government or funding is the answer nor solution.

I do not like any aspect of NCLB, I do not care for universal preschool, but I do like the idea that all children have a “right” to public education. Having a right does not mean there aren’t other choices available if one chooses, imo; it simply means that if other choices aren’t available to you for whatever reason (usually socioeconomic) that there is some form of education and you will not be left out–as in the haves and the have nots.

Now liking the idea does not mean I like an amendment!

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